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Who was the Real Boss: Nitti or Ricca?

Retired Intelligence Detective Gary Jenkins brings you the best in mob history with his unique perception of the mafia. In this conversation between Gary and Camillus Robinson, aka “Cam,” they delve into the intriguing histories of Frank Nitti and Paul Ricca, pivotal figures in the Chicago outfit from the Capone era to modern times. Cam discusses his book “Chicago Swan Song: A Mob Wife Story,” detailing Lisa Swan’s experiences living in the shadow of the Calabrese mob family during the Family Secrets trial. They explore the power dynamics between Nitti and Ricca, highlighting Nitti’s enforcement role and Ricca’s political savvy and connections with mob bosses nationwide. The conversation transitions to discussions around Capone’s influence, with differing perspectives on Nitti’s power after Capone’s downfall and Ricca’s rise to prominence. They delve into the organizational structure of the Chicago outfit, noting the mentorship roles that Nitti and Ricca played in grooming future mob leaders like Tony Accardo and Giancana. The conversation also touches on the Kansas City-Chicago mob connections and their intertwined history. Gary and Cam reflect on the transition from the prohibition era to modern times, emphasizing Nitti and Ricca’s legacy and impact in shaping the Chicago Outfit. They shed light on the mob’s complex relationships and power dynamics, pointing out how the Chicago Outfit Bosses changed while the organizational structure persisted. Gary and Cam keep the audience engaged throughout their banter with their deep knowledge and entertaining exchanges.
Welcome to Gangland Wire
The Swan Song of Chicago Mob
Capone’s Shadow and Chicago’s Shift
Ricca’s Rise and National Connections
The Hollywood Scam and Its Players
Ricca’s Ascendancy and Tragic End
Chicago’s Organizational Structure
Chicago vs. New York Power Dynamics
Nitty and Ricca: Pivotal Figures
Mob Summit in Las Vegas

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Welcome to Gangland Wire
[0:00]Welcome, all you guys. Well, welcome, all you guys.
I’m back here in studio Gangland Wire with my good friend, Camulus Robinson.
I tell you what, Camulus, I don’t know. I never have said your name right.
I get in trouble all the time for saying names.
I like to call him Cam. So, Cam Robinson. Welcome, Cam.
The Swan Song of Chicago Mob
[0:21]Cam it is, Gary. It’s good enough for me. It’s good to see you, man.
Good to be back here. here if chandler’s is
the worst i get that’s i don’t believe what i’ve got
through my life it’s all right brother it’s all right you know
you call me anything just don’t call me late for dinner as
the man once said so anyhow
uh cam had this idea and i thought it was a great idea
to talk about frank nitty and paul Ricca
but first cam as i said talk a little bit about your
book uh the swan song chicago mob
uh guy’s wife i don’t remind me
the exact title and and i’ll have a link in the show notes down below
guy really interesting book yeah thanks a
lot chicago swan song a mob wife story it’s uh i worked
with the massive um uh family secrets trial in chicago where they they took
down 18 guys they solved 18 murders and brought down a bunch of mob figures
and major hit men in the calabrese family specifically uh frank calabrese was
a big hit manual he had a son frank calvary’s jr who worked in his loan sharking crew.
[1:27]Frank calvary’s junior married with him lisa swan and
lisa and i worked together on
a book what was it like to to live in the shadow of one of these major mob families
in in chicago now she didn’t know exactly what was going on she didn’t know
behind the scenes but as the book progresses and as as lisa’s understanding
about things attention really ratchets up and you know up to the moment where
she learns who exactly her father-in-law, Frank Calabrese,
was one of the most notorious murders in the Chicago outfit.
And it’s her struggle to protect herself, protect her children,
sort of keep things as normal as possible while everything’s falling down around her.
Her son’s cocaine addiction and his non-stop work with his father and all the
aspects of things being gone and not being there for her and the fear that she
felt from her father-in-law Frank Calabrese, a really scary guy.
A lot of people want to know about the Calabrese necktie, just choking people
out and splitting their throats.
It really was a dark time, but Lisa really came through it.
To hear her tell that story with the humor and the real compassion she has for
people while still just… She’s funny as hell.
We’ve done some interviews or I’m going to bury it. So I appreciate the opportunity.
Let me let me come on and speak that it’s available on Amazon.
[2:52]And it’s a really, really big time.
All right. Great, Cam. You know, just a little side note here.
I was just contacted by a lady who is working with the daughter of a relocated
gangster from New York who actually testified against the Chin, Gigante.
And he ended up in Kansas City. And so they’re trying to find an FBI agent.
I’m trying to help them to find the FBI agent who was this guy’s handler.
I won’t say who this guy’s name is right now. I think he’s dead,
but I guess that’s probably why the daughter’s wanting to write the book.
But these family members writing books, because that’s, you know,
as you learn from Lisa, that being a family member of a mobster, you’re part of it.
You may not want to be and you think you’re not part of it in a way, but you’re part of it.
No matter because you’re carrying secrets all the time and growing up and living that life.
You know, we just don’t understand what that would be like in the straight world.
Capone’s Shadow and Chicago’s Shift
[3:49]That’s exactly right. pressure that they
feel even if they don’t know what’s going on they know that there’s something
they have to keep quiet over and that the kind of the kind
of pressure cooker situation that built is really it
creates a lot of tension situation really
interesting let’s talk about frank
nitty and paul the waiter Ricca a great idea
let’s uh start out tell us you know a little
bit about why you think this is interesting i guess cam
it’s kind of your idea why do you think this is interesting i
know why i think it is why do you think it is you know
here’s where i’m going to lose a lot of people’s uh uh faith in
me any in the two or three people still have any sort of
credit that i have any sort of credibility with anymore
but uh i think to my mind when capone went away in 31 a lot of people say that
that uh frank uh meeting was was really just a front boss and everything was
interrupted from the beginning i don’t know that i still buy that for for a
couple of reasons that we can discuss.
You know, that’s what we’re here for. But I think that he had a lot more power
early on and up until a certain point in the mid-30s than people give him credit for.
I’m not saying that Rico wasn’t the power behind the throne or that he had sort
of staged a coup by 43 when he shot himself when he shot himself ahead of the Hollywood trials.
[5:17]But I do think for several years there when we see a lot of the change in the
outfit that took place after the poem a lot of that came about in the form of
a shift in the the type of people it became more italian organization i mean
40 percent italian relation to uh to a 70 italian organization,
i think that during that shift and what i’ve been told by the people were murdered uh is when we see.
[5:43]Maybe lose power and regain that i don’t think it’s across the board he’s black
or white as people think yeah and you know frank nitty he he definitely came
out of the capone era he was capone’s enforcer there’s no doubt about it he
he was he was a bad guy and you know frank nitty.
[6:01]Those of us who are of a certain age remember the untouchables robert stack
tv show that was It was immensely popular back in the 60s.
[6:10]It was all Frank Nitti, all Frank Nitti, Frank Nitti. I mean,
to me, Frank Nitti back then, Frank Nitti was more important than Al Capone
in many ways because that’s all they ever talked about in the popular media at the time.
So he really got a big name, shall we say, among the entire United States as
this incredibly vicious, tough, unrelenting boss of Chicago Bob.
And all knowing, all seeing, he was bigger than Capone in a way during those years.
Now, you know, as history has brought out a lot more information about that
whole setup and us mob fans have gotten more sophisticated and mob scholars
have gotten a lot more sophisticated.
We now realize Al Capone was the man.
I mean, he was the man. And Frank Nitti did help him out and he was his enforcer.
But there were other people. It was such a big organization,
wasn’t it? You had Tony Accardo was in there. He was helping.
He had to be under Frank Nitti at
some point in time because he was a big enforcer early on in his career.
He was the guy that got Joe Batters, you know. So kind of what do you remember
about how that all, you know, that early days when Nitti was up and coming and
Ricca was there and Accardo was there. They were like contemporaries at one time.
[7:31]Absolutely. Absolutely, you
know, Carter would have been a little bit younger, but the thing is, in.
[7:36]Much a diversified organization at that
time it was it was so distinct and
it was it really represented more of a corporation and the outfit always
has as as we’ve talked about for years gary that uh the outfit is not as is
pyramid shaped as as what a lot of the uh more traditional italian organizations
are in uh you’ve been you know you’ve got this this wing is gambling and enforcement
which is where you’ll find Tony Riccardo.
[8:03]And this is more about the politics and the different power that bridges out.
And while there tends to be a guy at the top, it’s more in the days after the
phone, it was more of a board of directors, especially immediately after the phone.
So to say that there was one single boss sort of negates the way that the organization
was structured by guys like Johnny Torrio and Al Capone. Antonio was not about a one-person rule.
He structured this entire crime commission, and then years later, he advised Dr.
Luciano about how to set up the National Crime Commission and then the commission
of mob families in the United States.
The outfit was never designed to be a pyramid it became
that eventually around about a vibe a rivalry well
the late 30s and 40s but that was not the case early
on but it was still under johnny torio’s shadow
paul rick i’m thinking back to
these two men who were contemporaries i would
say nitty just maybe a little bit older a little bit more seasoned than Ricca
but but Ricca was he was from sicily because they were trying to deport him his
whole life and nitty was was native born well he is the thing is he was from
campania which is how he came to come to this he was he’s reaching campania in um.
[9:24]That was in England, where he wasn’t Sicilian, but he respected the Sicilians,
and he tied himself in with other people from his region, Don Eugenio Esposito.
He didn’t come straight in jumping with the total liberation.
He founded it and found himself with another power, Don Eugenio Esposito,
and Alderman, who was also a political figure and something of a group by himself.
But that was when he worked at the Bell in Napoli and became the waiter,
and that was how he sort of began it.
Became a 40 scotty working for that joke rather than.
[9:58]Because he was seeking out people from his own from his own uh geographical area you know region,
yeah i was mistaken there i was thinking it was sicily but
he was from campagna and people tended to
bring the old world with them and
and connected with people from their same particular area
of the the old world when they came over here and and he
was always more sophisticated than nitty it always appeared
to me he dressed better uh he looked better
and and like you said nitty and we talked about nitty
was about enforcement nitty was about strong arm
tack Ricca was more about politics and he also
if i remember correct me if i’m wrong wasn’t he
kind of and he become like the outfits liaison
with other mobs around the country particularly some
close connections to new york do you remember much about
that he was he was that was where that was
where Ricca’s national star really grows you know as as
you said you know with the committee a little bit older and he he was not he
ended up in a number of relationships they would work together capone did take
around uh recap and introduce him around um that he was very well connected
around um chicago and you play your strids in these organizations like any organization.
[11:16]And Ricca, he took him around, he introduced him around to other bosses and said,
Ricca’s Rise and National Connections
[11:20]this is going to be the place where Chicago would be the boss.
I don’t know that he always would have been traveling around speaking to people,
I could be wrong, and I know lots of people think that I am.
I just think that he started, that was the path he took towards forming his
own light, was to make partnerships with these mobs outside.
And once Prohibition was over in the, who was that, 30, was Prohibition in the
building, they hadn’t done much of that. time.
[11:44]And then he did come up with several of the rackets that they would eventually go on to use.
He thought if they could get into a bartender’s union, because we knew that
alcohol was going to be a huge industry.
And of course, they did come up with the restaurant record sheet that the Malaysia racket pulled.
The Hollywood scheme had a lot to do with Mitty.
I think that he had a good idea of how to make money, had a scheme and different
different things and I think that they both were well-tied in the Chicago area
where I think Ricca really,
really started plotting the proper course as he was so at that Bell and Napoli
with Diamond Joe Esposito.
The other, the bus boys and everybody who worked there, those were all the 42 gang.
They all knew, they worked under Diamond Joe Esposito as soon as he started.
Ricca, whereas Nitty was tied in with the old guard, you’ve got Ricca who was
working with the younger up and comers.
I mean, they’re still all kids at this from Charles 1618, but they are working
under the same political boss, Joseph Zeta, that Ricca has come to seek out in the world.
The Hollywood Scam and Its Players
[12:50]So this you’ve got this pressure cooker situation this up-and-coming guy who
was he was met upon by the 19 by 1927-28 paul Ricca who also knows guys like sandy kana and,
sam’s to stephano and all these 42 gang
young young kids who were 17 18 this is just murderers
but they’re also going to be the future ranks in the outfit and
as they rise and they join the outfits that’s where
you see Ricca’s start really come to the fore not
when a bunch of 19 year olds are already around but
when they start turning 25 26 27 and that’s
when he’s able to maybe they get into this
hollywood scam those of you guys that don’t understand
that it’s uh the outfit to a
guy named willie byall that really started in chicago
organizing the motion pictures uh projectionist union
and and then they kind of exported that out to hollywood
and by the time they got done they were in all these
trade unions out there that were around the
motion picture business started extorting money out
of the the unions and from the uh directors
not directors but the owners of the major production companies and and so and
and then it all fell down and they were all involved this had to be a huge cash
cow to have all those guys involved because how many he fell on that Hollywood
scam besides Rico and Nitty. Tremendous.
[14:15]Louie Louie Campagna Campagna, yeah.
Campagna and Johnny Roselli and there was Charlie Nogeo Charles Joe who was
a Kansas City liaison at the time actually.
He had Des Moines and he also was connected to Kansas City.
He was kind of a liaison down here is my understanding So those guys all fell.
Tell us what happened when they all started falling.
[14:44]They’re all down. They go to prison. And then he was tied up in that suit.
Ricca’s Ascendancy and Tragic End
[14:49]And then he got in prison until 1930, 1931.
He came out a couple months after Capone went in.
And he was claustrophobic. He had a lot of anxiety.
Couldn’t do any more time on the barge. So when, by this time in the,
in 1942, 43, Ricca had really become a powerbomb today.
And, and I don’t think that there was even any attempt to say that he was not.
I think that he just, it just had to do to have a power race.
I don’t think there was anything other than the boss, he used to be the boss.
It’s just that he used to take this one and, and it made him an annoying interesting
boss, at least that’s the story that we’re told.
It didn’t do any good because Ricca was only 10 or 2, but then he wandered
down into the train yard and shot himself twice in
the head work that one out here and probably if you see i don’t know if anybody
killed himself he killed himself twice in that but he really did he he literally
did miss the first shot and had the gum shitting wearing a fault to to fire
a second round he throw rolling stay back and he really did that he was dedicated to his last act,
and uh Ricca went down ultimately he was going to go down anyway so i don’t believe
this apocalyptic story that Ricca told Nini, you’re going to have to take all this on your shoulders.
I don’t know. I think Ricca would have gone down anyway.
[16:04]So I don’t know. A lot of people say that support for Dr. Ricca as the boss.
I don’t know, but I believe it. I think that they all went down.
They did some time in Atlanta.
Then this is where you get the Supreme Court involved, where Riccardo is working
on the scenes and he’s working with, they get up through the Attorney General’s
and they basically get a pardon.
[16:29]At a federal level when these massive mob
bosses come out of prison that i mean it was such a
scandal uh during the uh that was
the treatment yeah demonstration yeah so
that was such a national scandal that uh you
know homeboy got wrong right right the guy had
to come back home and uh that’s uh that was
that was hung on uh i was on on truman’s at
the yard he dispersed first i’ll do for truly general said i can’t be
a truly general his name was tom clark
tom clark tom clark was his name yeah you know
and in regards to that i i’ve done that story
before talk about the hollywood scandal several years ago and studied that and
and the way i understand that the day that nitty or day before nitty killed
himself they had a meeting at his house i believe they’re down in cicero and
and all these guys and they they discussed what was going to happen now Now,
one story that came out was Ricca was really the boss and he ordered Nitti said,
you’re going to have to take the load on this. So the rest of us don’t have to go to jail.
[17:33]I don’t buy that because Nitti killed. OK, Nitti kills himself.
But but all the rest of them still go to jail. I mean, why didn’t somebody else
then step up and say, well, OK, I’ll take the load.
The government doesn’t work like that. They don’t let everybody off because
Frank Nitti is going to plead guilty.
They don’t they’re not going to let the rest of those guys off.
They’re going to do whatever they can.
They can put all of them they can in jail they’re making that kind
of a deal not at that point in time they had the
heads of the outfit you know all dead to rights
and a big national crime with a lot of
attention and you know this is you know that just nobody one person could take
the load so then on that i just i couldn’t buy that he ordered that and they
all go to jail after that what’s another interesting thing about that whole
thing and tom clark i know a little bit more about that But, you know, really,
you know, during that time, Accardo was coming down.
[18:27]Acting like he was signing in as a tax lawyer from out of Chicago to visit these
guys down in Leavenworth all the time.
And we had somebody, Nick Civella, not Nick Civella, whoever,
Tony Gizzo, I think, would have somebody go up and meet Cardo at the Union Station
here in Kansas City and take him up the 40 miles or so to Leavenworth.
And so, you know, shows the Kansas City family and the Chicago family working together there.
And so he was working on that and
and kansas city see harry truman came out
of the pendergast organization which was very closely
tied to the outfit in kansas city there was a political organization just like
the roger tooey or whatever whoever in chicago daily eventually daily daily
daily but the pendergast organization was was they’re the ones that really were
responsible for Truman’s entire career.
They promoted him to be the state senator, the national senator early in his
career and put him really on the path to become president.
So these Chicago guys are in…
[19:38]Leavenworth they got 10 year sentences and they want out
bad got Kansas City and Chicago closely
connected the Kansas City family’s connected
to Pendergast Pendergast is closely connected to Harry Truman the president
Harry Truman has appointed Tom Clark as the attorney general and Tom Clark makes
some funny decisions in order to approve these guys parole after about three
years you know I don’t need to paint you much more of a picture than that do I,
i appreciate that you did though.
[20:12]So that’s a good breakdown that’s uh i mean it it’s just amazing i mean like
harry truman in 1946 had asked pendergast to make sure a local fifth district
congressman wasn’t re-elected he was a democrat and wasn’t doing what president
truman wanted him to do and so pendergast goes to charlie Benagio,
the Kansas City mobster, who was kind of their quasi-mob boss,
but more political boss in their political contact,
and goes to him, and they cheat like hell in the 1946 election.
I did a whole movie on this called Ballot Theft, Burglary, Murder, and Cover-Up.
So they have this unholy connection with Harry Truman for a long time.
Harry Truman, on one hand, was clean as a houndstooth, But on the other hand,
Chicago’s Organizational Structure
[20:58]he had some dirty roots and he was a loyal guy.
You know, he was nothing else. He was loyal.
So there’s no doubt that that’s how that all went down. Because it was a huge scandal at the time.
Practically, I mean, it didn’t cost Truman the election, but it was close.
It really, the Republicans really dug that dirt up big time when he ran in 1948, I believe.
So everything’s old is new again. So, in the end, Paul Ricca and Frank Nitti
were more peers, I would say, all along. I think that’s a fair assessment.
And Chicago has this history.
[21:41]Of kind of more of an organizational structure of where you have more like a committee.
You don’t have this strong personality that’s out front.
Like Al Capone was at one time, like John Gotti wanted to be like,
you know, lucky Luciano.
They never did have that kind of a guy.
They had big name people, but you know, Ricca and, and a Cardo,
they, and Jackie’s Rome would drive a Cardo,
And they would sit at this restaurant up there in the 60s and 70s at Mayo’s
Northwood Restaurant, and people would come to them.
And, you know, they really were responsible for Giancana being the out front
boss while they were sitting back.
And same thing after he left, you know, Iupa, you know, they were still kind
of involved in the early days of Iupa. Oh, yeah.
Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. Absolutely. I think that was a trick that they did learn eventually.
I don’t know to what extent it was going, like you said, with Ricca and with
Nini, but they definitely did perfect that.
Somebody’s got to be the face. It wasn’t as big a deal in the 30s and 40s.
Even though Tony had been what he was, I think that, you know.
[23:03]It’s hard to look at Nidhi and Ricca and see too much besides what somebody was mentoring.
Virgil Peterson of the Chicago Crime Commission, one of the early guys,
said that Nidhi was something of a mentor in the early days.
I think that you’re exactly right.
They did eventually order in those front bosses, and maybe it’s something they
learned from Ricca and Nidhi in the later days.
It’s probably not wrong about that. that it does seem to be the way things are swinging at the end.
But you look at, you got Giocanna, you got Sanitaglia, you’ve got,
basically, right before you’ve got…
Who was before Iupa? Between Di Sanaglia and Iupa, who was in there?
It was the murder, the murder mobile.
Felix Alvaricio. Alvaricio, yeah. Alvaricio, yeah. Yeah, so you’ve got several
of these guys that they just propped up there and stuck them out because the old brain couldn’t die.
And they just didn’t have a lot of big brain troughs to draw from to put in
that position with Riccardo and not wanting it.
An interesting setup up there in Chicago.
They were sugenerous, as we say in the legal profession. They were kind of one of a kind.
So it’s always interesting in Chicago, though.
Chicago vs. New York Power Dynamics
[24:27]And they’re much more powerful than new york the five families in new york weren’t
they cam i want to start a start a war out here you’re gonna get people swinging on me on the street,
from both from both cities,
really well they’ll have a hard time fighting you where you are now and witness protection.
[24:56]I’ll be up in Newark in a couple of days. I better be careful.
I guess you probably, when you go to New York, you probably ought to shave your
beard off before you go in.
Nitty and Ricca: Pivotal Figures
[25:09]All right, Cam, this has been great. It’s a discussion about those two,
you know, really pivotal characters in the history of the Chicago outfit.
I mean, you just, you know, they are the outfit from Capone to the modern times.
Those two guys bridge that whole
thing started with nitty and ended with Ricca and and
on up to a cardo who is more the modern boss
and when they had the you know all the teamsters money out in las vegas and
and all that going on so it’s uh those two guys were hugely important bringing
from the the the prohibition into the modern era that’s what they were all right
cam guys don’t Don’t forget,
buy Cam’s book down here in the show notes. You’ll find a link to it.
You got anything else you want to tell us about? Anything you’re getting ready to do, Cam?
Really, that’s it. I did a tour of the Mob Museum here recently with your help, Gary.
You can reach out to us and man’s out there. It’s really quite a tour.
It’s a hell of a thing to get set up there. Yeah. It’s blazing.
[26:17]You know, I really appreciate that. I think that anybody who gets out to Vegas,
it’s a pretty large, quick, out there it’s
definitely definitely worth it and uh i know that
um yeah there’s some talks about things being
followed thing i was saying cool all right yeah you’re
welcome just happy to help out there i think uh jeff schumacher out there was
happy to meet you and talk about some things when you’re out there because i
know there’s a little something maybe scheduled that maybe will happen out there
because i texted him afterwards and i said you know I’ve got an idea.
And he said, I told him, he said, yeah, that’s a pretty good idea.
It’s funny. We were just talking about that.
So anyhow, guys, just watch the
mob museum for some program that might be really interesting out there.
They all have great programs out there. Oh, it’s incredible.
Incredible. Frank Calabrese is currently working with the mob street residents. Right.
[27:12]I wonder if they’re going to continue that. He’s going to do a stint.
He’s not living out there forever. It doesn’t seem like. but
he’s the he’s the mobster and residents so i wonder
if they’ll get somebody else after that they could get that i bet they get that
south police he’s uh he’s living out there somewhere close by you know we’re
having the uh the mob summit out in las vegas guys i’ve got a uh uh look on
my youtube my youtube my uh,
facebook group and you’ll find some links to that
it’s going to be some frank calabrese will talk and
be like a dinner and frank calabrese will talk and sal palizzi
who was uh from the new york mobsters uh
he was never a made guy he was uh he was connected to several of the families
but he was connected he was the first guy that ever testified against john gotti
actually in the the first trial that they got he got a not guilty on palizzi
tells a hell of a story he really does He’s a hell of a funny guy.
You want to see somebody who can tell a great story. Yeah.
[28:14]And so that’s the Mob Summit in Las Vegas.
If you can’t find it on my Facebook group or can’t find my Facebook group because
Mob Summit in Las Vegas
[28:23]it’s hard to find, I had to take it private.
Email me or contact me some way and I’ll hit you to what needs to be done.
I know there’s still tickets available.
Oh, don’t forget, guys, if you have a problem with PTSD, be sure and go to that
VA website. site. If you’ve been in the service, get that hotline number.
If you’ve got a problem with kind of the goes hand in glove with it is drugs
or alcohol addiction, go find old Angelo Ruggiero or is it Anthony Ruggiero?
Angelo Ruggiero down in Florida. He’s got a hotline number on his website.
He’s a drug and alcohol counselor down there.
[28:58]And find my Facebook group. It’s got 60,000 members.
We had a lot of great mob discussions, a lot of great mob pictures, got mobsters,
mobsters relatives and friends and and
ex-mobsters on that page it looks to me like or
that in that group it looks to me like nobody really tells everybody
that they’re a real mobster but so from
some of the comments i’d say they might be and uh
youtube be sure and like and subscribe if
you are on the audio be sure and give me a
review and uh keep coming back
i really like doing these stories and and
cam i really appreciate you coming on the show i like doing
stories with you and i know i get a lot of positive feedback from guys they
like hearing us together i was always having a good time brother and i i read
the feedback if you believe and it really it really means a lot to me that is
to see to see people you and i can go and talk about a bit having a big time

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