Podcast: Play in new window | Download
Subscribe: Apple Podcasts | Android | RSS | More
Retired Intelligence Detective Gary Jenkins takes you on a riveting journey through the dark corridors of mob history. Step into the shadows with Gary as he sits down with an esteemed reporter and author, Larry McShane, to unravel the enigma that was Vincent “The Chin” Gigante, a man whose life reads like a gripping crime novel. Larry McShane, a seasoned veteran of the city beat, delves deep into his book “Chin: The Life and Crimes of Mafia Boss Vincent Gigante,” shedding light on the man behind the myth. Vincent Gigante’s story is one of intrigue and terror, a tale of a professional boxer turned merciless assassin whose very name struck fear into the hearts of his enemies. Handpicked by the notorious Vito Genovese to lead the Genovese Family, The Chin amassed a fortune of over $100 million, all while evading the relentless pursuit of federal investigators. But beneath the facade of power and wealth lurked a mind shrouded in darkness. Gigante appeared as a madman to the outside world, roaming the streets in a tattered bathrobe, playing games in storefronts, and hiding a second family from his wife. Despite his bizarre antics, Gigante’s cunning and ruthlessness knew no bounds, as he controlled an underworld empire of nearly three hundred made men. It took decades of intense FBI investigation by federal authorities to bring down the man who seemed untouchable finally. We learn they not only sent The Chin to prison but also forced him to admit he had been acting like he was crazy to avoid prosecution for many years. Join Gary Jenkins and Larry McShane as they peel back the layers of myth and legend to reveal the chilling truth behind one of the most notorious figures in mob history.
Support the Podcast
Subscribe to get new gangster stories every week.
Hit me up on Venmo for a cup of coffee or a shot and a beer @ganglandwire
Click here to “buy me a cup of coffee”
To go to the store or make a donation or rent Ballot Theft: Burglary, Murder, Coverup, click here
To rent Brothers against Brothers, the documentary, click here.
To rent Gangland Wire, the documentary, click here
To buy my Kindle book, Leaving Vegas: The True Story of How FBI Wiretaps Ended Mob Domination of Las Vegas Casinos.
To subscribe on iTunes click here. Please give me a review and help others find the podcast.
Donate to the podcast. Click here!
Transcript
Welcome all you wiretappers. Good to be back here in studio gangland wire. I have a really interesting guy today. You may have all heard of him. He wrote the book on the chin Gigante. I have Larry McShane. Welcome Larry. Hey, good morning. Thanks for having me. Well, Larry, start out talking a little bit about your book, you know, how you got into it and, and, you know, because we can always get it on Amazon.
I’ll have guys, I’ll have links to the book in the show notes. So tell us about getting into your book. Yeah, I’d covered a lot of organized crime stuff in New York. I worked for Associated Press for a long time. And You know, I guess it’s, it’s the kind of thing where I looked around at some point and, you know, there had been guys were writing their own books, right?
Sammy the bull, for example, there was a whole book about little Al DiArco and yet nobody had really done any kind of a project involving a Gigante [00:01:00] who I found as kind of the most compelling mob figure. Out of that generation and that time when the mob was finally kind of brought down by the FBI. He was interesting.
And guys, the name of the book is The Chin. Let me give you the tagline on it. It is The Life and Crimes of Mafia Boss, Vincent Gigante. So by Larry McShane, like I said, I’ll have the the title, I mean, the link to the Amazon and the show notes. So how did you start out? Writing this book, did you like go to the FBI to do FOIA?
Did you get, did you have some mob sources or just agent sources? Tell a little bit about the process of doing a, on a guy that’s so secretive that he put on this act, this crazy act all those years and so secretive that we’ll get into later. He stayed in the background and pretended like fat Tony Salerno was the boss when he really was.
I mean, this guy was an enigma. Yeah, there was I mean, by the time I started doing the book, [00:02:00] Giganti had been in jail for some time at that point. And, and so there was some, some lapse of time between the whole story and, and and my decision to try and find somebody to, to buy this book, which they did.
And the timing was such that there were a lot of people still around who were involved in the whole prosecution. Lawyers. And I, I would say almost everyone I reached out to was, was eager to cooperate and gave me tons of stuff, you know because even though Giganti had been such a high profile boss, you know, his whole dodge of feigning mental illness for three decades and also made him a guy.
Who was very mysterious, although the most powerful mafia boss in New York, he was, he was something else. So you know, let’s talk a little bit about this this [00:03:00] enigma of, of him and the Genovese family would go all the way back. I was doing a little research on him about how they had this. This habit of having a real boss and then a guy that’s out on the street that everybody seems to know is a boss and, and plus they had all the, like, just the fact that he pointed the chin, you know, you didn’t say his name, you pointed at your chin and, and some of the other guys had those same kind of codes to avoid their names being heard on a wire tap or anything.
So talk a little bit about that out front boss and then the real boss back behind in the Genovese family. Yeah. When, when the chin took over I believe Tony Salerno was the boss at that time, fat Tony. And it was just agreed that he would be the face of the, of the family for lack of a better term.
And Gigante would actually be running the family. You know, and it worked so well that Tony got indicted in the commission trial and convicted on that while, [00:04:00] you know, the chin avoided. Prosecution until 1997, you know, almost two decades later. That was that, that was pretty slick. And like I said, they pointed to the chin I believe quiet Dom Shrello, they pointed at the lips.
There’s another guy that made the sign of like bull horns. And the pointing at the chin was always the big one. Don’t speak. Just, just point to your chin. I even, I even met kind of Periphery mob guy who connected back to New York. And I mentioned, I just kind of was trying to engage him. He was, we would, what you’d call associate and he was living in another city, but he connected back to New York.
And I mentioned you to Gante and he just started pointing at his chin. So yeah, pretty well known. And apparently people were still obeying that order, huh? This guy did. [00:05:00] Yeah, right. That was just like two years ago. So interesting. That’s funny. You know, when, when he. As he came up, you know, we start off with the famous Frank Costello screwed up hit and he, I believe he was Vito Genovese driver at the time and, and, and, cause he could talk a little bit about, did you go back that far about that, those first years as, as he came on up the, the chain of command, shall we say?
Yeah, well, he had been, he had been working as a, not working. He was fighting as a, as a professional boxer for a little while. And you know, he grew up in Greenwich village, which was you know, a place where there were a lot of guys who were in the life living around. And you know, he came into the family and then really, as, as you just referenced his, his big break, if you want to describe it, that was that he is he has given the Costello [00:06:00] shooting which was in May, 1957.
Fido Genovese is looking to take over the family. And and so Chin gets the job and it’s in May of 1957, I believe. Costello has just come home to his apartment on the Upper West Side, he’s in the lobby after a night on the town, and Giganti shows up, pulls a gun, and he delivers his famous line, this one’s for you, Frank, and then misses.
He just grazes, he just grazes Costello’s head, and Costello survives, and Chin goes. So, you know, I think that’s what’s interesting. Another interesting thing about the Chin Gigante is he bridges the mob from the Prohibition era, really, which Costello, Lansky, and everybody came out of the Prohibition era and the first organization.
[00:07:00] He bridges that. Divide between there and he’s an important mafia figure all the way up to the commission. And after, you know, like you see 10 years after the commission case before he finally goes down. So he just, he is the mob in New York city, but he’s one of the lesser known guys. Everybody knows Gotti and Sammy the bull and all that, but they don’t know Gigante hadn’t really been that much written about him either.
Yeah. I mean, Gigante. You know, it was not a guy who was a fan of, of bosses like John Gotti. You know, he was, he was not on board with the killing of Paul Castellano in 1985 you know, outside Sparks Steakhouse. That’s an unsanctioned hit of a mob boss, which, you know, the other mob bosses don’t want to see that become a trend, right?
No. Yeah. And I mean, it’s funny that this just came up. I, that the first big mob story I covered was that murder, which was in December of 1985. It was [00:08:00] Christmastime and Castellano got killed by the Gotti hit squad outside Spark Steakhouse on 46th Street. And I got sent over from I worked at Associated Press at the time.
I got sent over from our office to the steakhouse and you know, I’ve never seen anything like it before. Since the, the two bodies are laid out in the street, the doors of their, of their town car are wide open. The FBI has Klieg lights set up all over the place. I mean, I, I didn’t plan for this coming up, but I can recall almost every detail of it because it was I guess it’s one of the first big stories I got to cover and the scene itself was just so impossible to forget.
I can imagine that was, I mean, right in the middle of Manhattan around Christmas time. Yeah. All those people on the streets. Did you look across the street and see Gotti and Sammy the Bull sitting there watching? We only learned about [00:09:00] that later. And then, of course. You know, now, if you want to speak to Sammy about something, you can just call him on the phone.
He’s I know he’s available to chat. I’m sure you’ve spoken with him, right? Yeah. For 500 bucks. He’ll talk to you.
Hey guys, I’ll talk to you for free. But that guy, he wants money. As they say, Sammy was always an earner, you know, He was always a nerder. He’s still a nerder. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So, Gigante, another thing I, I found interesting is the the music business. And, and he was kind of involved with that Morris Levy and Roulette Records.
And, and it seemed like there’s a famous story where they held one artist out of a window, the mob guys did, and threatened to let him drop if he didn’t succeed to something. Can you tell us a little bit about that? Did you, could you touch on that in your book? Sure. Yeah, yeah. Horace Levy, as you mentioned, was the guy who who ran Roulette Records which was kind of [00:10:00] a smaller label, but still managed to have a lot of a lot of hit records back in that era.
Now he was friendly with, with Chin’s brother, too. You know, his brother was a priest, and the two of them paled around a little bit. And, and it was certainly you know, they say an artist friendly label. This was an artist unfriendly label. You know what I mean? Yeah. When, when I wrote the book I got a chance to speak with Tommy James of Tommy James and the Shondells.
They’re big. Well, you’re, you’re as old as I am. They’re a big, a big hit group in the sixties. You know what I mean? Had a lot of, a lot of hits. And You know, he basically told me that all the chart topping in the world did not change the arrangement financially, which was, you know, Morris Levy’s getting a lot and the performers are getting a little, you know what I mean?
And the label hung around for a while when, when Chin took over, you know, it, it was still a, still an operation where they could get money [00:11:00] from. But you know, at that point the industry was changing and Morris Levy was an old guy. You know, his time, it’s sort of come and go, but he He made a lot of money almost to say he stole a lot of money from artists who deserved it for the work that they did and he profited from.
Yeah, he did, and it was, I think Tommy James even has his own book out there. I tried to get him to give me an interview. I don’t know if I ever even got the message or not, but but I thought that would be interesting, you know, the, the movie, the was, I mean, the series, the Godfather of Harlem depicted the chin in that.
Did you happen to see that? No, I haven’t seen it. And You know, I, I won’t comment. I won’t comment on it. It wasn’t even close to, okay. It wasn’t even close to reality. Did kind of touch on the music business a little bit, but but that I tell you what, this guy was one of the kind of rackets was, that he liked, that he seemed to [00:12:00] like, he being Gigante.
Well, I mean, the, the Genovese family really had Had its hands into sort of everything. You know what I mean? There was a, they called it the concrete club in Manhattan, where the mob was getting a percentage of all the concrete used at different buildings under construction. You know, they were by all accounts, deathly against drugs, you know they had other businesses, other industries, construction and, you know, just kind of a steady flow of income from a variety of, of places, you know, they were, you know, with chin there, they were the number one operation.
Although Giganti had a reputation as a fair guy who didn’t want more than his fair share, you know,
Now, when, when did that whole act start, the whole crazy act? Was there like a genesis, there was [00:13:00] a, an event, I’m not, I’m not real clear on that. Was there an event that started that whole crazy act? Yeah, he’s he’s arrested, I should start at the beginning. He for a brief time in the early 70s. He’s married, and he moves out to suburban New Jersey.
He leaves the village, and while he’s there, he sends Christmas cards to the local police officers with some money inside. Not, you know, not like a thousand dollars, like five bucks. Sort of like a Christmas gift more than a bribe. But then this becomes known, and now all of a sudden, you know, there’s, there’s a whole to do.
And this is, this is when Giganti first brings out the crazy act. There was a 1971 meeting where he’s going to be interviewed with a psychiatrist. And he doesn’t like ease into it, you know, he just shows up the first day with the, the, you know, [00:14:00] the whole outfit, right? The ratty bathrobe, unkempt.
Unshaven. The hair is sticking up. And, and when the the psychiatrist arrives, rather than sitting there to greet him, he’s lying asleep in his bed. So that’s kind of the first incident where, where this came out, you know what I mean? And then it, then of course, it just became You know, it’s like he won the Oscar every year for best mob fake sick guy.
You know what I mean? Every day he’d go out and wander the streets of Greenwich Village in his bathrobe talking to himself. Well, I mean, that’s the thing is that you know, for a guy that had so much power and, and such a long reach within organized crime especially at first. But still even later on, you know, he didn’t really get out beyond the village much.
You know what I mean? His, his social club was right across the street on Sullivan street in the, in the village [00:15:00] from where his mom’s apartment was, which is where he wound up living. And so you would see him wandering the streets or you would not see him once he got inside the the triangle social club, his operation down there.
And you know, it’s, it’s funny. There was, I think one of the most famous stories is he was, he was walking through Greenwich village and the, the fed showed up. You know, they’re telling him to look and he sees the agents and immediately drops to his knees and folds his hands and begins acting as if he’s praying outside the church.
You know what I mean? And the other, the other great one is, of course, he’s living with his mom and the feds come to arrest him. And when they come in that house, they can’t find him and they go into the bathroom and he’s. Buck naked in the shower with the water coming down. Yeah. So, I mean, he played the role to [00:16:00] the Hilton and to the end, right?
Almost to the end. Almost to the end. We’ll get to that. Yeah. Let me tell you something, Larry. There’s nothing worse than to have to wrestle around and naked guy. Not absolutely nothing worse. I’ve had to do it. There is nothing worse. I’m just going to take your word for that.
Especially if it’s three o’clock in the morning, it’s about still about 95 degrees. Yeah. So, you know, it’s interesting that Genovese. You know, he was big into narcotics. That was one of his things. By now, by this time, they’re, they’re, the Genoveses are really against it. Is that what I understand? Yeah, that’s right.
Chin for sure was was an anti drug guy. You know, I think at that point they were pretty much Unquestioned at the top of the mob food chain in, in New York. And there were other ways to make money. [00:17:00] You know, they, they, again, they had a lot of power. They had a lot of connections and yeah, he just decided, you know, our family is not going to get involved in this.
Yeah, he’s probably smart on that. Keeps a lot of heat off. You know, they Tony Salerno, that big moneymaker, they got in the construction business. They figured out that that’s where the money was. Just like Sammy the Bull did in the in Paul Castellano did. The Gambino, they got and figured that construction business.
Manhattan was a huge moneymaker. And Tony Salerno, he fell on this windows case. Do you know any much about that windows case? Yeah, the windows case was well, as it sounds, the mob had figured out a way to take over the installation of windows in city housing developments, I guess, as they were being put up and, you know, like any other mob operation, the cost of the windows went up and then they skimmed off the top and that [00:18:00] was a really, really lucrative operation for the mob. You know I mean, it was, it was, when I say like, you know, this is a big deal, we’re talking about organized crime taking a cut of, you know, every window installed in every city housing project.
You know, that’s how, how deeply involved federal prosecutors said they were in this operation, you know, wow, that took a lot of organization and management and paying people off. And so, but I understand they made a ton of money out of it. I was going to say, I think it really illustrates, you know, the, the grip that, that the five families still had on, on the city at that point.
And you know, it really, I guess, started with. With Rudolph Giuliani taking over as U. S. prosecutor, you know, and then trial after trial after trial, and they won, they won them all, you know, yeah, they really want them all. Yeah, the mob can’t fight the [00:19:00] wiretaps and Rico. Right, exactly. And those draconian sentences that you could get on money laundering or a Rico case, you get these, you know, 40, 50 year sentences, you could.
I used to say you, you can make anybody tell on their mother when you’re, when they’re like a 60 year old guy looking at a 50 year sentence or a 30 year sentence, even it’s just, you know, before, you know, like guy said, well, I can do a trace down in my head. I can do five years, you know, easy, but not 50.
Well, I mean, everything started out with you know, two counts, 20 years each. And then they went from there. You know what I mean? Yeah. Yes. I knew that. Yes. They got tough. They really got tough. So talk about this. Let’s start talking a little bit about the beginning of the end here. He goes to the penitentiary on something and he continues to run his family through his son.
I think his son’s name was maybe, was it Andrew? [00:20:00] Yeah. I believe that’s right. Was he like running messages back and forth then, I guess from the Yeah, he was more of a messenger as opposed to like the head of the family, you know what I mean? Right. I I didn’t mean you sound was running, I guess, but he was right.
Relaying his dad stuff. And you know, it’s funny because this, this is not how the chin ever did things, you know? There, there’s sort of a famous. Mob story where, where John Gotti tells Gigante that John Jr. has just been a maid, become a maid guy. And Gigante’s response was, I’m sorry to hear that.
Yeah. You know, he did not want his family involved, but. By the time we’re in the 2000s, right? He’s, he’s in prison. He’s going to die behind prison. He’s still trying to keep some level of his fingers in, in the pie back in Greenwich Village. And you know, the game had completely changed by then, you [00:21:00] know the mob had no leverage.
If the government wanted to get you, they could get you. And in this case, there was There was a young mobster, a young Genevieve mobster who would flip and and start testifying against all sorts of, of people within the family. That was kind of the first for that family. One of the first guys that flipped then sounds like.
Well, I mean, yeah. He, he was one of the I guess I should say this, the core group within the Genevieve family never, you know, never Did you know what I mean? Right. There was no gravano. Or D’Arco, or, or, you know, other families had bosses who flipped and testified, right? Yeah, I’ve seen them. Yeah, there’s a perfect example.
That was that Cookie Durso, I believe, was a guy that, that flipped over some kind of killing of a relative, I can’t remember the exact story on that. Yeah, give me one second here. Okay. [00:22:00] Alright, I gotta just do one thing.
I apologize, my computer froze up, which I had some notes on. Okay, alright. Yeah. I see you got an Elvis Presley Boulevard sign back in the up behind you. I used to have one of those in my, when I had a house in the driveway. Elvis Presley Boulevard. I went, I went down there, God, ages ago, ages ago. Had a great time.
Memphis is a great city. Oh man, my son lived there. He was with the railroad down there and I went, I don’t know how many times I was in Memphis and did everything there was to do and then some. It was a great city. Yeah, yeah, yeah, it really was. But so yeah, the. The first prosecution or the second prosecution, I should say, of, of Gigante which is where he actually was compelled in court to acknowledge that, you know, [00:23:00] the whole Bathrobe Act and the other bizarre behavior was all phonied up, you know, to avoid prison.
But that was in, in a lot of ways. engendered by a guy named named cookie Durso, Michael Durso who went inside the, the family and you know, recorded, I think it’s like thousands and thousands of hours of conversations with different guys in the family, which you know, basically at some point ends up leading to You know, Giganti giving up the ghost and, and taking this second plea after his, you know, other conviction.
You know, I heard a story about him after nine 11, him calling some family members and, and dropping the crazy act. And they were able to to record that and confront him with that. You heard that story? Yeah. You know you know, the prison phones are [00:24:00] obviously, and yeah, he was certainly very rational.
About what was going on in his hometown from his jail cell for sure. You know, and yeah, I guess, you know, it’s, it’s sort of odd too, that that that’s the thing that after all he’d been through that, that, you know, it was this thing that got him to break character. But on the other hand, you know, we, we think of these guys as mobsters.
He’s also the father, the son, he’s got siblings. His mom lives in the village, you know, which is not far away from where from where the trade center was. You know, and he was, I guess on that day, he was just another guy concerned about his family. Interesting, you know, this guy was he illustrates what, what I find fascinating about the Mafia, the, the, the Cosa Nostra American Mafia families is that they have this dual existence almost, if you will.
They, they. Go home to the [00:25:00] suburbs many times, or he didn’t go to the suburbs, but, but they go home and they have these families and the families go, you know, and they show up at the kids school plays and the kids school functions. And they have Sunday afternoon dinner, a bunch of extended relatives, maybe come in just like they showed on the Sopranos and they have this life.
And then they go over to the city and they have this gangster life. So it’s, it’s fascinating to me. And he was, he was really the epitome of that. He was like what you, the story you told about the his son, he told Gadi and I’m sorry that your son, you know, is now in this thing of ours. But of course then Chin does the same thing himself eventually.
Right. Yeah. You know, so what are you going to do? What are you going to do? Yeah. Yeah. You know, you would think hard to figure out. Yeah. Again, you know, this is a guy who had as we discussed, said to John Gotti wouldn’t do it. Then in the end, he wound up doing it you know, just so that he could keep his piece of, of [00:26:00] the Genevieve’s family income, you know, there, there was certainly no prestige in having the title when you’re in prison.
Right. Right. No, no, it’s interesting. So you were in courtroom in the courtroom the day that he had, he, I understand he had to admit out loud in court and you were in courtroom that day. Can you, can you set that scene and describe that for us? And it had to be quite a, quite a scene that day. Yeah, it was quite a scene that day.
You know I think it was in 2003, April, 2003. And so at that point, you know, if you want to go back to Castellano, You know, I’d been covering, covering organized crime for a long time, you know, and you know, I’d been to different hearings and different things, but, you know, this was completely unlike anything else.
There was a, there was a big buzz beforehand because the word was sort of out that he was going to be saying this. And you know, [00:27:00] of course it’s on the court calendar. So, you know, you know, that at the very least, you’re going to see him in the courtroom at this point, which was increasingly rare. His son his son Andrew was in the courtroom as well.
He was being sentenced on on his own charges. But yeah, I, I mean, I saw Giganti in court before and he would do even something as subtle as this. He would act like he had a leg tremor. And so he would just, his leg would twitch the whole time, you know what I mean? As part of the sick act and a federal prosecutor once told me that Giganti was doing the twitching thing with his, with his right leg.
And at some point he looked over and he was, Giganti had switched to doing it with the left leg and the prosecutor said, he told him, Hey, wrong leg,
but, but yeah, on, on the day of, of when he drops the act, he comes in, he elder enters a guilty plea, he’s seen chatting with his son Andrew, he’s sipping a glass of water at the defense label table you know, he’s shaking hands and [00:28:00] greeting his lawyers you know, at one point I believe he was kind of laughing a little bit at the defense table, you know and then Judge Glasser the federal judge out in Brooklyn I asked Giganti if it was true that he had you know, for more than a quarter century done this whole thing, misleading all these doctors simply to you know, assure his continued success within organized crime.
And Giganti just says, yes, your honor you know and yeah, it’s funny after all those years, that’s just how it. Comes to an end, you know, federal judge answers a question and he just says, yup, that’s right. You know, I, he he also he also, when he showed up, you know, he didn’t show up in like a suit or tie, you know, it wasn’t like that kind of thing, you know, Gotti, the dapper Don, you know, he was still you know, the hair was a little out there and he had a prison pullover shirt over a t shirt.
And he I mean, he’s an [00:29:00] old man at this point. He looked he was 75, I think, and you know, he looked like he was having a little trouble getting around, walking kind of gingerly as he came into the courtroom, you know?
Well, he was he was an interesting guy. How much longer did he live? I can’t remember. I want to say he died in 2005 at a prison in Texas. Oh, okay. He must not have gone to Springfield to the medical place, so. No, he just, right, he did not, I mean, you know, I guess they all have health problems, but he wound up they had Gotti, I guess, is the one I always think of who wound up in the dying in the federal.
Yeah, exactly. Down Springfield. Yeah. At one time I know a guy that was down there and kind of sent him down as a little bit of punishment. There’ll be a helper down there. And he had fat Tony Salerno was down there. And what’s his lefty Rogerio was down there. Oh God. Yes. They were all dying. Of course.
Yeah.
. All of a sudden, I forgot his first name. Carmine Benson. Benson Gigante. God, I can’t. I don’t know why all of a sudden I lost his [00:30:00] first name. Benson Gigante. He had quite a life. He was he was the ultimate Mafia boss.
It seems to me like the life of secrecy, which there any other stories you remember particularly about him that kind of struck you? Well, I mean, I remember this one. One of the things about him was that there was a lot of loyalty to the chin in his neighborhood. You know, it was a heavily Italian neighborhood.
In Greenwich Village and at one point the FBI came in and they went on the roof of of one of the buildings to set up a shed where they could do surveillance. And so they go up there at night in the dark and set this thing up and disappear. And when they come back the next day, it’s just been torn apart and left in rubble up there by, by the locals.
You know what I mean? You know, that’s always one of my favorite ones, you know yeah, yeah. You can’t get away with anything in those neighborhoods, those Italian neighborhoods. I know, I know you gotta be so sneaky. [00:31:00] It’s just, you’re going to be seen whenever you’re a stranger in the hood. Shall we say, yeah, I mean, he was You know, like almost like having some Hollywood star pop into your neighborhood if the Hollywood star was dressed like a bum, you know what I mean?
It’s crazy. All right. Well, Larry McShane, the book is. Chin, the life and times of mafia boss, Vincent Gigante. Look for that in the show notes, guys, you need to get that book. I know there’s not much out there on the social media and the articles and stuff about Gigante because he was so secretive. And I can imagine, Larry, it was really hard to get information.
Were you able to get hold of like this cookie Durso? Could you talk to him by any chance? No The guys that I talked to were mostly people who flipped like Gravano, for example. Yeah You know, or there were I mean, he, he was a guy that left behind a trail of a lot of court cases too. And I was also able, I was working at the daily news [00:32:00] to go back into the archives and find like a lot of stuff about, for example, the Costello hit.
So if you did a little digging, you could come up with a lot of stuff in spite of his efforts to ensure that nobody would hear much of this stuff. Interesting. So what are you doing now, Larry? You’re retired from being a newsman. I am. Chasing down sirens and ambulances, trying to get a story, running the scenes of mob hits.
I’m trying I’m trying to finish up another mob book on the Colombo Family War of 1991 through 93, which was kind of New York’s last big mob war. Yeah a little something, not much. I have to get you back on for that when you get that book out. Let me know. Oh yeah, I’ll let you know for sure.
I’ll let you know for sure. It’s my deadline is coming up, so. Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha. You know, but it’s been good. I, I, Vic Arena, who was the was the acting boss in one of the, the head of one of the [00:33:00] two families in this war his two sons are kind of cooperating and helping me with the book. So yeah, so far, so good.
Hopefully I’ll get it done. And yeah, I’ll let you know. I’d love to come back on. Thank you so much for having me. All right. Well, thanks a lot for coming on. Larry, you you are one of the I don’t know, to me, you know, like one of the big names in this business, you got to get some bigger names. I had Gus Russo on one.
See, there you go. I’m talking about like, like people that really take a legitimate. You know, newsman’s look at the mob, you know, kind of the whole thing, not just some guy that’s telling his personal life story from his, from his view, making himself look good. Look how generous and confident I was when I killed this guy
all right. Well, guys, don’t forget, check the show notes. For links to get this book, you need to get this book. And don’t forget, I like to ride motorcycles. So watch out for motorcycles when you’re out there on the [00:34:00] streets. And if you have a problem with PTSD, you’ve been in the service. Be sure and go to the VA website and get that hotline number.
Or if you happen to have a problem with drugs or alcohol, you don’t have to be in the former serviceman to get some help and. Former Gambino soldier, Anthony Ruggiano has a hotline number on his website and he’s a drug and alcohol counselor down in Florida. So maybe you could have Anthony Ruggiano be your drug and alcohol counselor.
If you have a problem, let me know. If you do that, I’d really like to hear that story. I won’t reveal your name. I promise. So be sure and like, and subscribe and. Tell your friends about the show and share on social media and all those kinds of things. So thanks a lot, guys.